Curse

Symbol · Feb 28, 2006, 02:46 AM // 02:46

There's been a ton of discussion on skills that deserve nerfs, but not a lot on what need improvement. I'd like to talk about those skills.

To keep this thread under control I propose that each person select one skill that needs improvement, state why it's underpowered currently, and then what they would do to improve it.

Also each post should include at least some commentary on the previous ones so that we have something to discuss.

I'll start off with an elementalist skill, since they are currently the class that's hurting the most.

Lightning Orb

Problem:
This is perhaps the quintessential elementalist skill. Good in theory, but crippled by a ridiculous 15E cost.

Consider that a 10E fireball does 119 damage vs a 60 AL target. A 15E orb does 140 damage. Orb is actually substantially worse in terms of damage per energy, MUCH worse when you consider that fireball is AoE (and consequently much harder to dodge and can hit multiple foes). Isn't air supposed to be the single target line? Why is its flagship skill so lackluster?

Improvement:
Energy cost reduced to 10E, damage upped to 20...110 (at level 15). Now orb is more efficient than fireball vs single targets as it should be. Also the damage increase gives air elementalist dps a (small) kick in the pants, something that they desperately need.

LifeInfusion · Feb 28, 2006, 04:33 AM // 04:33

I'd be happy if they made it so that it isn't a projectile. But that won't happen. The 15 energy isn't so bad, really.

Comparing it to fireball on a 60AL target is not a good idea. Armor penetration is only good on higher armor targets.

Symbol · Feb 28, 2006, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Quote:

Comparing it to fireball on a 60AL target is not a good idea. Armor penetration is only good on higher armor targets.

So? The point isn't to skew the comparison so it looks good for orb. Most of the time you'll be casting it at 60 AL targets. The other times you'll be casting it at ~100 AL targets.

So orb will do 140/83 damage. Fireball will do 119/60 damage. No matter how you slice it orb is worse efficiency wise, and this is ignoring fireball's AoE.

The skill is overcosted.

Mithie · Feb 28, 2006, 08:36 AM // 08:36

Mending. Seriously.

[FnG] Lazz · Feb 28, 2006, 09:08 AM // 09:08

Personally I think Conjure Phantasm deserves a buff. In pre-searing, it is very powerful (arguably slightly overpowered) but later on in the game, it doesn't become much use unless you combine it with another health degen spell.

I think it should be increased by damage amount, rather than damage time. Sure by the time you are say half way through the game (depending in attribute points) your probably doing 50 - 60 damage, but it takes a lifetime to get to it. I think it would be better for the Mesmer class if it was more like length: 10 seconds, damage: 8 health degen per second.

Mithie · Feb 28, 2006, 09:11 AM // 09:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by [FnG] Lazz

Personally I think Conjure Phantasm deserves a buff. In pre-searing, it is very powerful (arguably slightly overpowered) but later on in the game, it doesn't become much use unless you combine it with another health degen spell.

I think it should be increased by damage amount, rather than damage time. Sure by the time you are say half way through the game (depending in attribute points) your probably doing 50 - 60 damage, but it takes a lifetime to get to it. I think it would be better for the Mesmer class if it was more like length: 10 seconds, damage: 8 health degen per second.

What? You gotta be joking right? Conjure Phantasm (especially when backed up by Mantra of Persistence) is the BEST degen in the game, especially in the current metagame, when boon monks are ALL OVER THE PLACE (who has trouble with hex removal).

So... No.

tafy69 · Feb 28, 2006, 09:22 AM // 09:22

Well hexes are pretty pathetic in the current meta game tbh.

Cant hex monks easily with boon/CoP
Hexes fall off warriors like water off a ducks back

that leaves you to hex a probable 2-3 people from 8

Back to topic, I think Remove Hex should be 1 second cast!

Mithie · Feb 28, 2006, 09:24 AM // 09:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by tafy69

Well hexes are pretty pathetic in the current meta game tbh.

Cant hex monks easily with boon/CoP
Hexes fall off warriors like water off a ducks back

Nah. Even with the lieutenant's helm, Conjure will stick on long enough to be a threat, and boon monks can CoP themselves, but will have trouble de=hexing teammates.

LightningHell · Feb 28, 2006, 09:37 AM // 09:37

I still don't want to see that teammate over there spamming Conjure on that Mursaat. It sucks, when it goes to late-game.

But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer.

I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it.

Mithie · Feb 28, 2006, 09:43 AM // 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

I still don't want to see that teammate over there spamming Conjure on that Mursaat. It sucks, when it goes to late-game.

But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer.

I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it.

You don't see a use for chaining KDs?

tafy69 · Feb 28, 2006, 09:43 AM // 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

Nah. Even with the lieutenant's helm, Conjure will stick on long enough to be a threat, and boon monks can CoP themselves, but will have trouble de=hexing teammates.

15 second conjure at 16 spec?

7 seconds on warrior with hod helm

thats 70 damage for 10 energy where it should have been 150.

instead of removing the hex a monk casts 5 energy spell that heals 100+

Were getting off topic here...

Mithie · Feb 28, 2006, 09:45 AM // 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by tafy69

15 second conjure at 16 spec?

7 seconds on warrior with hod helm

thats 70 damage for 10 energy where it should have been 150.

Mantra of Persistence.

Quote:

instead of removing the hex a monk casts 5 energy spell that heals 100+

CoP only works for the monk, not for the rest of his team.

Quote:

Were getting off topic here...

No we're not. We're debating whether or not a skill needs a buff - in the this case CP.

Sab · Feb 28, 2006, 09:46 AM // 09:46

Buff Hundred Blades. For an elite skill, I'd expect it to be much better than it's non-elite axe counterpart, Cyclone Axe, which it's not. I'm suggesting one or more of the following improvements:

- Increase HB's area of effect
- Decrease the recharge time
- Add additional damage to each hit
- Hits three times instead of twice

tafy69 · Feb 28, 2006, 09:56 AM // 09:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mithie

Mantra of Persistence.

CoP only works for the monk, not for the rest of his team.

No we're not. We're debating whether or not a skill needs a buff - in the this case CP.

I guess I need to show you the second time eh

15 seconds + 80% from the mantra

Now you phantasm lasts 26 Seconds

13 seconds for the hod warrrior = 130 damage

130 dot damage over 13 seconds for 25 energy, yeah thats really nice...

And yes it is off topic as HoD helms isnt what were talking about. As you can see phantasm lasting its full length times to normal targets does some nice degen.

Okae · Feb 28, 2006, 10:09 AM // 10:09

Finally a post about buffs instead of nerfs.

Off the top of my head I'd like to see the following skills get a buff:

Warrior:
Skull Crack - As it is now, 9 adrenaline and very situational. Build up adrenaline and wait for the right moment. Maybe change it to have a 10 energy cost with a medium-long recharge.

Ranger:
Concussion shot - lower mana cost increase recharge. 15-1/2-20

Necro:
Chillblains - nice spell but at a cost of 25 and the need to carry another spell to get the poison off of yourself it needs help!

Mesmer:
Crippling Anguish <e>- I'd like to see it have a lower mana cost currently 15. Heck, Faintheartedness causes degen of 1-3 and slows down attacks to 50%. at only 10 energy.

Ele:
I know alot of people were upset with monsters running away from aoe spells but I particulary didn't care for stupid monsters that just stood in a fire storm the whole time. I think a good way to give the Ele's some dmg back is to increase the aoe on some spells. ie. from "adjacent" "to nearby" or to "in the area."

Tuoba Hturt Eht · Feb 28, 2006, 10:29 AM // 10:29

Recharge time for all these skills are way too long.

Too Long
Wary Stance - 60 seconds
Shield Stance - 60 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 60 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 60 seconds

Quite Long
Defensive Stance - 45 seconds

A bit long
Deflect Arrows - 30 seconds
Balanced Stance - 30 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 30 seconds
"I Will Survive!" - 30 seconds

I propose the changes:
Wary Stance - 30 seconds | 5 energy
Shield Stance - 30 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 30 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 30 seconds | 5 energy

Defensive Stance - 25 seconds

Deflect Arrows - 20 seconds
Balanced Stance - 20 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 20 seconds | 5 energy
"I Will Survive!" - 20 seconds

Symbol · Feb 28, 2006, 11:17 AM // 11:17

Conjure phantasm doesn't really need a buff if they nerf the HoD helm. If it is improved, the only change I could see working is to reduce the energy cost.

Hundred blades really only needs a small improvement. I think a reduction in recharge is appropriate.

Also, try and keep it to one skill per post please, that way it's easy for people to follow.

devilru · Feb 28, 2006, 11:23 AM // 11:23

Swirling Aura and Magnetic Aura:
Decrease recharge to 45 seconds atleast and make Swirling Aura on par with its counter part Magnetic Aura.

Glyph of Lesser Energy: should have a 15 second recharge.

Protective Bond : Perhaps just rework the whole skill, maybe an enchantment that lasts for 8 seconds instead of one that has to be maintained.

Balthazars Aura: Either reduce energy cost to 15 or keep the original recharge time. The only time you ever see a smiting monk is for farming, let's try and make smiting monks a valuable asset in a normal team.

Thrill of Victory: I liked the older version of this better. (Gaining HP on hit instead of extra damage)

Mend Condition: Targeting yourself would be nice, it wouldn't overshadow mendailment due to ailment's ability to give you a great HP gain from stacked conditions.

Tuoba Hturt Eht · Feb 28, 2006, 11:33 AM // 11:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by devilru

Thrill of Victory: I liked the older version of this better. (Gaining HP on hit instead of extra damage)

Noooo. Don't nerf my warrior spike skill.

I suggest that the recharge time be lowered to 7 seconds instead of 10 seconds.

Lower recharge time of Desperation Blow from 7 seconds to 5 seconds as well.

Nevin · Feb 28, 2006, 11:46 AM // 11:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symbol

Lightning Orb

Problem:
This is perhaps the quintessential elementalist skill. Good in theory, but crippled by a ridiculous 15E cost.

If you have the Air Attune/Ele Attune build, Energy is no problem. The 15 energy actually helps because you get 80% of that energy back when you cast it. Personally I don't use Lightning orb unless the person is coming head on is within 3 meters. If you use it against someone you're chasing, well duh its gunna miss. Lightning Orb does more damage then a fireball as well, and if it were downed to 10 it'd be much more spammable then it already is making Air Spikers too strong.

Skills that need buffs:

-Blood of the Master (Heal Area does the same job, but with out sacrificing) Should still cost 10 energy, same recharge, same 17% sacrifice; But it should give 160 hp at 16 Death Magic.

-Deathly Swarm (Casting time is 3 seconds) I suggest making it 2 seconds with a 6 second recharge time.